SI Deletes All Staff Photographers
- Thread starter distant.star
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The internet is taking its toll on all print media. They are cutting costs to try and keep afloat. The printed media industry, just like the audio recording industry is sinking, and need to make some bigger changes than merely laying off staff.
Trying to sell digital editions which cost much less to distribute but asking the same or even a higher price is a sure way to go out of business. IMHO, they should have a plan to convert the public to digital media by offering it at low prices, while phasing out the print side. The accountant types who run many such industries just can't seem to understand or cope with what's happening.
One day, they will wake up and find that someone else has jumped into the void. I wouldn't be surprised if it was Amazon.
Trying to sell digital editions which cost much less to distribute but asking the same or even a higher price is a sure way to go out of business. IMHO, they should have a plan to convert the public to digital media by offering it at low prices, while phasing out the print side. The accountant types who run many such industries just can't seem to understand or cope with what's happening.
One day, they will wake up and find that someone else has jumped into the void. I wouldn't be surprised if it was Amazon.
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I'm sure it will play out well for the magazine - no benefits, no office space, no gear budget, etc. For the photographers, it probably means less money per shoot, benefits and gear is all them now. It's rough out there...tolusina said:
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Why do you need staff photographers when there are thousands of people at major sporting events with DSLR's giving their photographs away for free.
These guys may starve to death free lance.
Looking at comments from a news article yesterday, there were many people with DSLR's offering to shoot the swimsuit editions for free.
I would throw my name in to that drawing.
These guys may starve to death free lance.
Looking at comments from a news article yesterday, there were many people with DSLR's offering to shoot the swimsuit editions for free.
I would throw my name in to that drawing.
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May cost less to distribute but that's a small part of the cost of creating the content. You still need writers, executives, editors, accountants, project managers, computer programmers, computer administration, computer operations, computer security specialists, admin assistants, facilities managers, janitors, maintenance people, security guards, HR people, WEB developers, graphic designers, and more.
Running office buildings and computer centers is not cheap either, security efforts and costs are constantly on the rise. All the employees want to be kept safe at work which means keeping offices secure 24x7. Protecting online content so those consuming it actually pay for it and other suppliers aren't redistributing it without compensation or credit. Most people would not drive into a gas station fill up and drive off without paying. But for some reason downloading content or sharing online accounts isn't a problem for many.
Investors have come to expect 20% returns from their investments. For some reason they don't expect the same from the likes of Amazon. If they ever start, what's going to happen to Amazon?
Consumers want everything for free or cheap(er). Who do they think is going to keep producing the stuff they consume? If you don't pay for what you use eventually no one will be left producing it. Push the deflationary cycle far enough and there will be too few people willing/able to pay for your product/service and you end up out of a job too.
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All 6 remaining photogs fired from Sports Illustrated; zero left
https://nppa.org/node/69374
https://nppa.org/node/69374
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Re: All 6 remaining photogs fired from Sports Illustrated; zero left
A lot of businesses in USA are heading in that direction now to lower overhead costs. I'd image photographers will continue covering events, but as contract - freelancers. The company then pays no benefits nor retirement. Altho' we don't really know what the employer / employee relationship is between staff and SI at the moment anyway.
Many magazines and art agencies have gone to 'freelance' or contract relationships with writer / photographers lately, Well, in fact, it's been that way for some a long time already. It might become a 'weekly / daily' monthly column or journalism piece contract on a continuum.
When I worked like that with several magazines years ago (continuing contract), I wrote three columns per week (wrote words and supplied images) and was just like an employee, sorta, because we all knew the editorial calendar, and supplied what fit at our own choices. If we had no 'assignment', then we were free to choose anything we could cover or find, or figure out, long as we made deadline and filled our 'subject' slots-- and all the writers / photo guys there did the same thing.
And, we never even discussed it once it began -- we just filled the slots on the calendar that had our name in it, and the subject, or most often, chose our own based on guidelines. It "felt" just like an employee in a sense, but we chose our hours, and often our subjects -- but the pay system changed. One fat check, no deductions, no employer benefits, no employer matched funds (like no medicare, no tax deductions) ...
Sorta like self-employed, but we went to work -- altho' it was never 40 hour week, and never the same hours. We collected our assignments as if employed, but were free to vary our schedule as long as the "editor' got his calendar filled on time. Lots of companies without a large employee base are going this direction ... and even some large employers are creating a version of it that reduces employee overhead costs.
A lot of businesses in USA are heading in that direction now to lower overhead costs. I'd image photographers will continue covering events, but as contract - freelancers. The company then pays no benefits nor retirement. Altho' we don't really know what the employer / employee relationship is between staff and SI at the moment anyway.
Many magazines and art agencies have gone to 'freelance' or contract relationships with writer / photographers lately, Well, in fact, it's been that way for some a long time already. It might become a 'weekly / daily' monthly column or journalism piece contract on a continuum.
When I worked like that with several magazines years ago (continuing contract), I wrote three columns per week (wrote words and supplied images) and was just like an employee, sorta, because we all knew the editorial calendar, and supplied what fit at our own choices. If we had no 'assignment', then we were free to choose anything we could cover or find, or figure out, long as we made deadline and filled our 'subject' slots-- and all the writers / photo guys there did the same thing.
And, we never even discussed it once it began -- we just filled the slots on the calendar that had our name in it, and the subject, or most often, chose our own based on guidelines. It "felt" just like an employee in a sense, but we chose our hours, and often our subjects -- but the pay system changed. One fat check, no deductions, no employer benefits, no employer matched funds (like no medicare, no tax deductions) ...
Sorta like self-employed, but we went to work -- altho' it was never 40 hour week, and never the same hours. We collected our assignments as if employed, but were free to vary our schedule as long as the "editor' got his calendar filled on time. Lots of companies without a large employee base are going this direction ... and even some large employers are creating a version of it that reduces employee overhead costs.
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Re: All 6 remaining photogs fired from Sports Illustrated; zero left
Yes, this is very sad for the photographers and the profession.
However, even in my youth, when an aunt, uncle, or grandparent would give me a gift subscription (pretty much every year through my teens and even into my 20's), I might read one or two issues out of the year, including, of course, the swimsuit issue.
Waiting room at the dentist's or barber? It would be the last thing I'd pick up, only out of desperation.
I was crazy about football, but found their coverage even of that boring.
This says as much about the product as the profession, but there is so much coverage of sports on TV now, and of course on the web, that by the time a photo hits the print edition of SI, it is VERY OLD news.
Still, a jolt to read this and be reminded of how deep the transformation across economies since the Web caught fire.
Yes, this is very sad for the photographers and the profession.
However, even in my youth, when an aunt, uncle, or grandparent would give me a gift subscription (pretty much every year through my teens and even into my 20's), I might read one or two issues out of the year, including, of course, the swimsuit issue.
Waiting room at the dentist's or barber? It would be the last thing I'd pick up, only out of desperation.
I was crazy about football, but found their coverage even of that boring.
This says as much about the product as the profession, but there is so much coverage of sports on TV now, and of course on the web, that by the time a photo hits the print edition of SI, it is VERY OLD news.
Still, a jolt to read this and be reminded of how deep the transformation across economies since the Web caught fire.
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Lurker is spot on! I think the Internet being free is something people cling to. You only have to see the (quite justified in my opinion) annoyance on here when we see an example of a photographer's work being mis-used for commercial purposes without credit or recompense to the person who took it.
However, so many people seem to expect a wide variety of things for free and see no problem with downloading free copies or accessing things for free that should be paid for. It's no less theft than walking into a store and stealing from the shelves.
However, so many people seem to expect a wide variety of things for free and see no problem with downloading free copies or accessing things for free that should be paid for. It's no less theft than walking into a store and stealing from the shelves.
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Yes, fragilesi, this is true, and it is having a huge impact.
Even in my own photo-club, with all the amazing free tutorials out there, some members are grubbing for "shared" Kelby or Lynda memberships. I mean seriously, our local library gives most of this stuff away, but they think it all should be free or cost nearly zero.
And rare is the charitable organization that acts charitably towards volunteer photographers who provide top notch images for their cause. While people who pour cups of water for participants get invited to dinners and ceremonies, I often see photographers who have spent hours at the event, more hours processing, completely forgotten.
Sigh. Such is our lot in life. Woe is me.
I wonder what the percentage of people is who actually value, appreciate, discern the difference of a wonderful shot that captures an emotional or phenomenal moment versus those who think a selfie shot with a kissy face is just as good as a Pulitzer prize winner.
Even in my own photo-club, with all the amazing free tutorials out there, some members are grubbing for "shared" Kelby or Lynda memberships. I mean seriously, our local library gives most of this stuff away, but they think it all should be free or cost nearly zero.
And rare is the charitable organization that acts charitably towards volunteer photographers who provide top notch images for their cause. While people who pour cups of water for participants get invited to dinners and ceremonies, I often see photographers who have spent hours at the event, more hours processing, completely forgotten.
Sigh. Such is our lot in life. Woe is me.
I wonder what the percentage of people is who actually value, appreciate, discern the difference of a wonderful shot that captures an emotional or phenomenal moment versus those who think a selfie shot with a kissy face is just as good as a Pulitzer prize winner.
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To follow up earlier post ... right on target, so many DSLR's out in an audience, and all clicking away, at least one or two are bound to "get lucky" and hit a 'reasonably decent shot', and offer it for peanuts or free.
The quality of images for web use is quite low, and here today gone tomorrow when the new instant pages fill again in the AM. No one will pay what it takes to buy gear, spend time, get the shot, process it, and send it off, when it an get a near freebie that is "well, good enough" for today.
As far as SI goes, i haven't read one in awhile, but did read it often in past years -- what I considered a great sports magazine. Coincidentally, I picked one up and thumbed thru it at (you guessed it) the doctors office. And what a disappointment -- if felt 'cheap', the writing was uninteresting, and less pages. The stories seemed grabbed out of thin air - and it becomes OLD news (an oxymoron?) before it hits the street.
Current stories now get reported to death every day -- and when you read about a golf event or a race event a month later, it's seems silly now when we can get same day video on the web, if not live coverage when it happens.
Lurker Quote: "May cost less to distribute but that's a small part of the cost of creating the content. You still need writers, executives, editors, accountants, project managers, computer programmers, computer administration, computer operations, computer security specialists, admin assistants, facilities managers, janitors, maintenance people, security guards, HR people, WEB developers, graphic designers, and more."
Exactly right on target, but the 'field workers' are the first to feel the bite, because the 'workers' (writers / photos) can be 'replaced' or contracted out for less money (it often brings less skill too, but doesn't seem to matter in our instant read it (use it) and throw it away society) -- management NEVER cuts itself, and production is production, you need content ... so, that leaves the 'creative component', and that's the part that suffers. Most folks don't appreciate nor understand what it takes to create quality writing (solid research) and detailed images, good 'freeze action' and the timing it takes to understand your subject enough to 'be there for it' ... In the moment shots now seem an 'accident of a spectator w/DSLR' rather than photographer planning.
The quality of images for web use is quite low, and here today gone tomorrow when the new instant pages fill again in the AM. No one will pay what it takes to buy gear, spend time, get the shot, process it, and send it off, when it an get a near freebie that is "well, good enough" for today.
As far as SI goes, i haven't read one in awhile, but did read it often in past years -- what I considered a great sports magazine. Coincidentally, I picked one up and thumbed thru it at (you guessed it) the doctors office. And what a disappointment -- if felt 'cheap', the writing was uninteresting, and less pages. The stories seemed grabbed out of thin air - and it becomes OLD news (an oxymoron?) before it hits the street.
Current stories now get reported to death every day -- and when you read about a golf event or a race event a month later, it's seems silly now when we can get same day video on the web, if not live coverage when it happens.
Lurker Quote: "May cost less to distribute but that's a small part of the cost of creating the content. You still need writers, executives, editors, accountants, project managers, computer programmers, computer administration, computer operations, computer security specialists, admin assistants, facilities managers, janitors, maintenance people, security guards, HR people, WEB developers, graphic designers, and more."
Exactly right on target, but the 'field workers' are the first to feel the bite, because the 'workers' (writers / photos) can be 'replaced' or contracted out for less money (it often brings less skill too, but doesn't seem to matter in our instant read it (use it) and throw it away society) -- management NEVER cuts itself, and production is production, you need content ... so, that leaves the 'creative component', and that's the part that suffers. Most folks don't appreciate nor understand what it takes to create quality writing (solid research) and detailed images, good 'freeze action' and the timing it takes to understand your subject enough to 'be there for it' ... In the moment shots now seem an 'accident of a spectator w/DSLR' rather than photographer planning.
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monkey44 said:
No no no no no, that is absolutely not what this is about. It is about making some of the best general sports photographers in the world freelancers rather than staffers. It means no more gear budget, no more medical benefit costs, no more post processing staff and equipment and the office space and cost they incur, no more travel expenses etc etc, it is about cost cutting not about buying the one shot a fan might have, those fans will never get the access and they will never get the releases, heck most high end sports venues have 8" lens limitations.
The same photographers will be shooting the same venues with the same gear, SI will not have any of the costs associated with getting a photographer, or photographic team, to a venue and they will have the ability to buy any freelancers images if they want to.
What will happen is the ex staff photographers won't make as much effort to try new stuff, they will have to concentrate on bankable sale-able images first and foremost because they now have gear budgets, travel costs, and health insurance, to pay out of whatever they can sell on the market.
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privatebydesign said:
This is true, most venues limit the fans equipment. They will not be in the location or spot to get the great shots.
I go as a fan to the local NBA teams games occasionally. I have gear better than or equal to any of the photogs setting on the floor. I have met the General Manager of the team and the local News Paper staff in a profesional setting. It's very easy to pick up the phone and offer my services for nothing, so I could sit court side at a spot in front of people who pay close to $1000 per seat. I wouldn't do it, not because I lack the skill but it is just to much work.
These guys are in a profession that people are giving it away cheap or free. I will not do it but I bet others do.
Unfortunate for these SI guys, pursuing their chosen profession is getting tougher to make a decent living.
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privatebydesign said:monkey44 said:
No no no no no, that is absolutely not what this is about. It is about making some of the best general sports photographers in the world freelancers rather than staffers. It means no more gear budget, no more medical benefit costs, no more post processing staff and equipment and the office space and cost they incur, no more travel expenses etc etc, it is about cost cutting not about buying the one shot a fan might have, those fans will never get the access and they will never get the releases, heck most high end sports venues have 8" lens limitations.
The same photographers will be shooting the same venues with the same gear, SI will not have any of the costs associated with getting a photographer, or photographic team, to a venue and they will have the ability to buy any freelancers images if they want to."
Monkey44 responds:
Yes, I agree totally as this applies to SI and other high end magazines - cost cutting at the Pro level.
My statement was more about how most local venues now take free-lancers instead of staff, and in all but the very high-end pro level sports, the audience will and does present 'snap and click' images to local venues and the local venues accept and publish those at next to nothing $$ and the true freelancers that work at it for a living are often shut out.
Yes, you're correct and i even mentioned that we freelancers reduce the cost of staff because in addition to "less per images costs" -- the overhead, gear, insurance, etc is not borne by the venues any longer ... we are both on the same page ...
But I can tell you, when we were back in the film days and shooting drag racing -- if an engine blew or a car hit the wall, or flipped, all of us were out in the audience with dollar bills and release papers collecting film just in case one of the fans got it on camera ... lots of accidental 'cool shots' hit the local papers with a "don't know this guy" byline one time only name.
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